Lewandowski: Most Of The Time When Roger Stone Is Talking, He Is Lying


Former Trump campaign manager Corey Lewandowski talks to CNN's John Berman about special counsel Robert Mueller's final report on the Russia investigation and the status of Trump associate Roger Stone. Lewandowski continues to advise the president and is the author of a new book, "Trump's Enemies: How the Deep State is Undermining the Presidency."

COREY LEWANDOWSKI, FORMER TRUMP CAMPAIGN MANAGER: So Roger Stone's history with Donald Trump goes back 30 years. He's been someone who has known then Mr. Trump and worked with him through business dealings long before we ever started a political campaign and long before I ever met Mr. Trump.

When I came to the Trump Organization in January of 2015 to start to look at him potentially running for president, Roger Stone was living in Florida and speaking to Mr. Trump on a fairly regular basis at that point. As the campaign progressed and we launched the campaign, Roger Stone, I -- I ultimately fired in about August of 2015, and he wasn't around the campaign very much. He worked through Sam Nunberg, who was his emissary to the campaign. And then by August or September of 2015, I also fired Sam.

BERMAN: Why did you fire Roger Stone?

LEWANDOWSKI: Look, he wasn't doing anything on the campaign. He was living in Florida, you know, doing, you know -- I don't know what he was doing, to be honest with you, but he had no value, and so I didn't want to pay somebody for not doing anything.

BERMAN: But he continued to talk to the president, correct?

LEWANDOWSKI: Well, look, I think, you have to remember, a 30-year relationship was in place. And did they have phone conversations after I fired him? They did. They were very limited in scope when I was near then candidate Trump. And I can't recall Mr. Trump speaking to Roger Stone on more than half a dozen occasions after her was fired.

BERMAN: When you would hear that then candidate Donald Trump was speaking to Roger Stone, what would your reaction be?

LEWANDOWSKI: Oh, it would drive me crazy, right? I mean maybe it was the same reaction that the White House has when they hear I'm talking to Donald Trump now, right? I don't know. But what it is is, you know, Roger Stone is a conspiracy theorists --

BERMAN: Right.

LEWANDOWSKI: Who makes up these crazy ideas, says crazy things, only to recants them or say that he didn't actually do what he said he did. And so people like that I didn't think were helpful on the campaign. And so, you know, I didn't enjoy when Roger was calling.

BERMAN: Do you think Roger Stone was trying to get the hacked e-mails from WikiLeaks?

LEWANDOWSKI: Well, he said he met with WikiLeaks or he said he met with Julian Assange. This is what he wrote in e-mails. This is his own words, only when pressed on them did he say, well, what I said and what I did were actually two separate things. So I don't know.

But if you take Roger at his own words, which are very difficult to do because most of the time he's lying when he's talking, I don't know what the truth is.

BERMAN: You think it's possible he was involved with the release of the hacked e-mails?

LEWANDOWSKI: I don't know. I -- look, do I think Roger wants to pretend to be this master of the dark arts and has access to all of this information that he really has no access to and takes credit for things he had nothing to do with, absolutely.

BERMAN: Do you think it's possible he spoke to the president about WikiLeaks and what they had in their possession?

LEWANDOWSKI: You know, I don't know. And I can tell you, whenever I was with then Mr. Trump, candidate Trump, never was I there if he was speaking to Roger Stone about that particular topic.

BERMAN: There's a denial from Rudy Giuliani, who's the president's current attorney, told "The Washington Post" the president does not recall ever speaking to either Stone or Corsi about WikiLeaks. As you know, from being in the business, I do not recall is not a "no."

LEWANDOWSKI: Yes, look, again, I don't know of -- I don't know Jerome Corsi, just to be clear.

BERMAN: Right. You've never met Jerome Corsi.

LEWANDOWSKI: I don't believe I have. Maybe in passing, but no substantive relationship whatsoever.

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