Joining us now is the chairman of the Democratic National Committee, Tim Kaine. Mr. Kaine is also the former governor of the Commonwealth of Virginia.

Mr. Chairman, thanks very much for joining us tonight. Nice to have you on the program.

FMR. GOV. TIM KAINE, DNC CHAIRMAN: Always glad to be with you, Rachel. Thanks.

MADDOW: Let me give you a chance to correct me first on something that I made up. I‘ve said, what Democrats need to do to win in the midterms this year is, they need good candidates for open seats, they need to pass health reform, and they need to make sure everyone in the country - left, right and center-knows about Republican hypocrisy on policy.

Does that bear any resemblance to the actual Democratic game plan?

KAINE: You pretty much nailed it. I mean, there is one more, which is: we got to continue to push forward with programs like the Recovery Act so that the economy continues to improve. Two quarters of GDP growth in a row is good. Job loss is dropping from 720,000 a month to kind of almost net even is good.

But we got a ways to go still. So, that would be my fourth element.

Obviously, the president‘s been focused on that since day one.

But the other three are right. You know, we‘re going to tell the success story. We‘re going to point out Republicans who have been engaged in this hypocrisy, acknowledging that the stimulus is good while pretending before the cameras that they‘re against it.

And then the candidate recruitment and making sure that our folks are energized to support the candidates is the key. In a tough climate, in a tough year, I think we‘re going to do better than people expect.

MADDOW: On this issue of hypocrisy, and we‘ve been talking about it a lot on this show. We‘re no longer the only ones doing it. It seems like there‘s a lesson for Democrats here, too, on policy.

Why would you try to compromise and find common ground with people who reject their own ideas, who hold two totally opposite positions on the same policy at the same time? It‘s like trying to divide by zero. I mean, is there not-is there not a sort of message here for governing Democrats in terms of the futility of trying to find bipartisan policy solutions?

KAINE: Well, Rachel, here‘s the way I would say it. I think what the American public wants to see is, this is a time of national urgency and emergency, they want to see people working together. The Democrats have been willing to do all this heavy-lifting while the Republicans have made a decision to be obstructionists and vote no, even to hope that these policies fail.

Nevertheless, I think they want to see us reaching out to try to get them engaged. We shouldn‘t be deluding what we‘re doing to chase after non-existent votes, but we should still be reaching out and asking for ideas. And if the other side has good ideas, then those should go into the policies that we put together.

I think that‘s been the president‘s strategy. We‘re going to keep reaching out. We‘re going to keep listening. But we also have got to demand that the other guys take their governmental responsibilities seriously and when they engage in this kind of political games, like around the stimulus funding, talking out of both sides of their mouth, we got to point it out.

MADDOW: I know on health reform that you think it is important for the country. I know that you think it is important policy.

KAINE: Yes.

MADDOW: In purely political terms, do you think it is important for Democrats, for the November elections, that health reform is passed soon?

KAINE: Rachel, I do. I think it is absolutely critical. It‘s critical because, as you point out, Americans need it. The insured need more security from abuses by insurance company, and the uninsured need a path to affordable coverage for the first time in this country. And we definitely need to figure out a way to stop this backbreaking premium increases and the costs that are going to keep skyrocketing, absent meaningful reform. So, it has to happen, because it‘s good policy.

But I also agree with you, politically, it‘s a measure of our coherence and our ability to make things happen as Democrats, that we-that we, you know, follow the president‘s lead and get health reform done. I just came out of a meeting about that, and it is-it‘s just incredibly that the Dems make it happen.

MADDOW: When you say you just came out of a meeting about that, are you telling us that something is about to happen?

KAINE: No, that is not-this was kind of a strategy meeting. I don‘t-I‘m, you know, within my own pay grade. I‘m the guy who‘s leading the party. But I was-you know, I‘m asking questions about it, and I know that there‘s intense activity to try to find that path to success.

It‘s a harder path to find when the other guys have made it a decision that 100 percent of their game is going to be throwing up roadblocks. But now that we know that that‘s the game, and now that we‘ve incorporated ideas such as they‘ve been offered and the president is going to keep reaching out to the guys to see if they have other good ideas, we need to make this happen.

MADDOW: Let me ask you one last question that I think could go some distance to reassuring a lot of people who voted for Barack Obama and Joe Biden in the fall, and who are worried about what‘s going to happen this fall. What do you think went wrong in the Massachusetts Senate race? What are the lessons learned and what are you going to do differently because of what you saw happen there?

KAINE: Rachel, I would say a couple things. You know, first, you know, there‘s all these things that could be better about campaigns that are run, even winning campaigns could be run better. So, I think there were some things about the campaign that could have been done better.

But let‘s set those aside. I think from our standpoint, at the Democratic Party, you know, when a candidate says, hey, look, this race is going fine, we‘re in great shape, we need to check under the hood. And we need to make our own assessment of, in fact, is that true.

We were able to generate intense activity from volunteers at the DNC. Volunteers in support of this race, once we realized there was a difficulty in this race. But I think candidly, from our side, we should have started earlier.

I think there are some issues about messaging and the focus on policies that were important to independent voters in Massachusetts. Some of it is about, you know, items of significance, you know, certainly jobs in the economy, dealing with this tough and thorny issue of the deficit. Very important for independent voters, but also, not just policy, but in the way it‘s communicated.

So, I think there are lessons for the Democratic Party and there are lessons for the White House. But I think people-you know, I think, I‘m describing this as our ghost of Christmas future experience, Scrooge didn‘t like what he heard from the ghost of Christmas future, and he asked, "Hey, look, do I get to change the future?" And the answer was: yes, you do get to change it.

If you make some adjustments now, you could make some changes. I would rather have learned in January of 2010 than November of 2010.

MADDOW: Tim Kaine, chairman of the Democratic National Committee, former governor of Virginia-sir, I know you know this, but you‘re good on TV, and you should be on TV more. We haven‘t seen enough of you recently, and I think people-

KAINE: Yes.

MADDOW: -- would like to.

KAINE: The two-job thing was a challenge on my first year. You‘re going to be-you‘re going to be sick of how much you‘re seeing me soon.

MADDOW: Very good. I look forward to it. Thank you, Governor.