STEWART: Today‘s vote in the Senate Finance Committee is by no means the end of the road for health reform. But its prospects of becoming a reality just got a big boost.

Joining us now from the Russell Rotunda on Capitol Hill is Democratic Senator Charles Schumer of New York. He‘s a member of the finance committee and voted for the bill that passed today.

Senator, thank you so much for taking the time tonight.

SCHUMER: Good evening.

STEWART: You call the bill you voted on today, quote, "not ideal but a good bill." Despite your best efforts, the public option was not part of it. Why not?

SCHUMER: Well, we didn‘t have the votes, obviously, but we are making good progress once again. We never thought we‘d win in the finance committee, but 30 Democrats signed a letter saying the public option must be in the combined bill. There are many others who were supportive. The four of us in the leadership didn‘t sign the letter, because it was to the leadership, we‘re for it as well.

And I am very optimistic that we‘re going to get a strong public option. The House is standing firm on public option. And I think all of those, when they saw the vote in the finance committee who thought, "Oh, it‘s over," hadn‘t really read the situation correctly.

STEWART: Well, how do you get it done? How does it end up in the final bill?

SCHUMER: Well, first, Leader Reid has the option of putting it in the final bill. If he puts it in the final bill, in the combined bill, then you would need 60 votes to remove it. And there clearly are not 60 votes against the public option. If-and so, we‘re urging him to do that and he‘s seriously considering it.

Once it passes the Senate, if that were to happen, it‘s in the House bill, it‘s in the Senate bill, and it would have to be in the final product. So, it‘s very important to see if the public option is in the bill that Leader Reid puts together. He hasn‘t yet made up his mind, but many of us who believe in the public option are urging him to do so. And so far, we‘re getting-we‘re getting heard.

STEWART: Let me ask you about some of the more conservative Democrats in the Senate, like Senator Lincoln or Senator Nelson. How might they be convinced to support the public option?

SCHUMER: Well, they don‘t even have to support the public option. As long as they‘d support a final bill with the public option in it, there are some suggestions. One of the things that Senator Carper and I have been talking about is a possible opt-out; that you‘d be in the public option unless your state opted out. So, if a state felt very strongly they didn‘t want it, they wouldn‘t be forced into it.

There are other types of changes that would still keep the strength of the public option, but would be considered. My preference would be to have a complete public option in the bill, and that‘s what we‘re working towards right now.

And again, if it‘s in the bill, you don‘t have to have every Democrat vote for it, because if it‘s in the bill, to take it out would take 60 votes. So that‘s one of the cases. One of those rare moments where this 60-vote rule which we usually abhor works in our favor.

STEWART: Senator Schumer, in your statement, you praised Committee Chairman Baucus for his, quote, "tenacity." What was he particularly tenacious about?

SCHUMER: Well, just moving forward. This is very hard to do. There are all kinds of special interests who are against the bill. There were all kinds of things that have to be done to get health care costs down, that would get the insurance companies mad, or get the drug companies mad, or this one or that one. And he just kept moving forward.

I didn‘t agree with him every step of the way. We had, of course, our discussions on public option and on several other issues, too. But he kept moving forward, moving forward.

And if you believe, as Olympia Snowe said, and I think most Americans do, and most Democrats, liberal, moderate, or conservative that we must have a bill, whether you agreed or disagreed with specifics about Senator Baucus, he clearly moved the process forward. President Obama was very happy at the end of today because the finance committee did actually vote out a bill. I would have preferred it to be.

STEWART: You brought up the president.

SCHUMER: I would have preferred it to be a little different in one area or another, but we have moved forward. And as I said, this is the most conservative place, the finance committee. The Senate floor will be more progressive and the House more progressive still. So, the bill is going to get better from that point of view.

STEWART: You brought up the president. He came to office talking about bipartisanship and extolling the virtues of working with Republicans. But after so many months, negotiating on health care, just one Republican senator signed on today.

Are the Democrats negotiating away things for a bill Republicans won‘t support anyway?

SCHUMER: No, I don‘t think so. We‘re not going to. On public option, my view is, we have to have it in whether we get any Republicans or not.

But, I would say this. It was much-it was-we always make an effort for bipartisanship and what we found here is that the Republican Party is the "party of just say no." No, no, no. Ninety percent of the amendments they brought forward in the finance committee were either gotcha amendments, senators should go on Medicaid or something, or amendments that were just negative.

What is the Republican plan? You don‘t agree with us? Do you think we should keep the status quo and have Medicare go broke in seven years, have tens of millions of people possibly thrown off private insurance or at least have that private insurance greatly curtailed?

What‘s your alternative, guys, gals? They didn‘t have one. And that is helping us.

STEWART: New York Senator Charles Schumer, thanks for your time tonight.

SCHUMER: Nice to talk to you, Alison.

STEWART: And now, from the senator to the former chairman of the Democratic Party and the former governor of Vermont, we‘d like to welcome, Dr. Howard Dean.

Dr. Dean, thanks for being here.

GOV. HOWARD DEAN (D), FORMER GOVERNOR OF VERMONT: Alison, thanks for having me on.

STEWART: It can be argued that the bill passed today marks a historic moment for health care reform in this country, because we‘ve rarely, if ever been this close. How do you see it?

DEAN: Well, from a process point of view, Senator Schumer is right. You had to get a bill through the finance committee and I thank Max Baucus for getting a bill through the finance committee.

Having said that, it‘s not a bill that I would vote for-it really isn‘t. This shovels hundreds of millions of dollars of taxpayers‘ money to insurance companies, there‘s no cost control in it. So, you know, I think that it needs some work.

But, you know, it‘s just tough to get it out of the finance committee, and I think we ought to thank the finance committee for their hard work. But now, the real fight begins. This is not health care reform, the finance committee bill. It‘s insurance reform. I think insurance reform is a good thing, but it‘s not worth all those hundreds of millions of dollars of taxpayers‘ money.

STEWART: You mentioned cost control. Can you describe three components of what you would consider an ideal bill?

DEAN: Yes. Well, the first thing I‘d consider is having people to be able to sign up for Medicare if they‘re under 65. And the reason for that is, first of all, Medicare‘s very efficient. You can‘t have taken away from you. You don‘t lose it if you lose your job. You can take it anywhere you want in the country.

And while it‘s growth has gone too high at twice-excuse me-at 2 percent above inflation, private insurance growth has gone up at 2.5 times the rate of inflation. There is no cost control in the Senate Finance Committee bill.

So, look, I don‘t want to be a jerk about this. I think President Obama‘s right. I think these guys worked very, very hard, under very difficult circumstances. It is a conservative committee.

But now, with we are at a historic point. We‘ve got to have a good bill. Any bill won‘t do, any bill is not a victory. We‘ve got to have a good bill that works and it serves Americans well. And that means, give us a choice. It ought not to be up to the Senate whether we get the choice of a public option or not; that should be left up to us to decide for ourselves and our families what‘s best for us.

STEWART: What would you say to Senator Olympia Snowe if she was sitting right next to you right now?

DEAN: I‘d say, thank you very much. It‘s about time the Republicans and Democrats start working together. This bill is something that thoughtful people ought to be able support.

STEWART: It‘s hard to believe but it‘s-you know, it‘s really been almost a year since the Democrats won the White House quite convincingly and came to dominate both houses of Congress. Why has it been such a struggle to get the kind of health care reform that so many Democrats, especially recognized Democratic leaders, what they want?

DEAN: Well, I think a lot of insurance companies are a very, very powerful lobby. They pour tons of money into campaign coffers. That influences votes.

This is a conservative committee. I think Democrats got scared. They got scared in August when the town hall meetings came up.

You know, you‘ve got to understand, you‘ve got to learn the lessons. We won the majority because we stood up for what we believed was right, not because we tried to become like Republicans. And that‘s the old Democratic Party. The new Democratic Party has a big majority, we have a president, and we ought to use that majority, because if you don‘t use your majority on behalf of the American people, you lose that majority.

And the reason I mentioned Medicare is, we ought to have some up and running that some people can get insurance through by 2010. Otherwise, all these myths that the Republicans have been putting out there are going to be circulating around during the election time. And a lot of House members on the Democratic side are going to lose their seat.

So, we don‘t to have the whole bill in place by 2010, but the easiest way to get people insured is to allow some people to sign up for Medicare that are under 65. And that should be done. It‘s a good program.

You do not have to use Medicare rates. I‘m with the more conservative Democrats on that one, with Senator Schumer, but you do have to have a bill and let Americans choose whether they‘re going to be publicly insured or privately insured. That‘s our choice. That choice ought not to be made by insurance companies, politicians, or demagogues.

STEWART: We‘ll have to leave it there for this evening. Governor Howard Dean, thanks for being here.

DEAN: Thank you.