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April 12, 2009

Interview with the Mexican Ambassador

Face the Nation

SCHIEFFER: And, good morning again. The ambassador from Mexico is in New York this morning, Arturo Sarukhan. Mr. Ambassador, thank you so much for joining us. The president goes to Mexico this week at a time when the Mexican government is fighting these drug cartels, nearly 7,000 people killed in the violence down there last year. Number one, what do you want from the United States on this front? And what will your president be telling President Obama when he gets there?

ARTURO SARUKHAN, MEXICAN AMBASSADOR: First of all, Bob, that as most things in life, you need to two to tango. And as Mexico seeks to shut down the flow of drugs coming into the United States from Mexico, from South America, we need the support of the United States to shut down the flow of weapons and bulk cash. I think it is very clear that President Obama, who has been seized by the importance of the bilateral relationship, since even before his administration kicked off -- the flurry of visits by Secretary Clinton, Secretary Napolitano, Attorney General Holder, down to Mexico in previous weeks, I think have started to push the ball in the right direction.

I think the key issue right now is how can the United States help to shut down those guns and shut down that bulk cash that is providing the drug syndicates in Mexico with the wherewithal to corrupt, to bribe, to kill?

SCHIEFFER: In your estimation, where are most of these weapons coming from? From the United States?

SARUKHAN: Ninety percent of all weapons we are seizing in Mexico, Bob, are coming from across the United States. Just on the Arizona and Texas borders with Mexico alone there are approximately 7,000 FFLs, federal firearms licensees. And a lot of the weapons that are being bought by the drug syndicates, either directly or through proxy purchases are coming from those gun shops.

SCHIEFFER: The National Rifle Association and the gun lobby takes issue with your statements that most of them are coming from the United States. What data do you have to back that up, Mr. Ambassador? SARUKHAN: Well, the data that we have is the one that we've been sharing with our counterparts in the U.S. government, ATF and the Justice Department, and other agencies that have been working with us to determine where those guns are coming from. Look at the most recent large seizure in Reynosa, a town that is on the border. In November, in a military checkpoint, just about three or four kilometers into Mexican territory, we seized more than 250 assault weapons and half a million rounds of ammo. These had just crossed over the border from the United States into Mexico. By tracing back these weapons, by looking at the types of weapons, we're determining that most of these weapons are coming from the United States, Bob.

SCHIEFFER: I don't want to belabor this, but they say that the people who take issue with this say that actually only 17 percent are coming from the United States, that the rest of them are coming through Central America, some are coming from Israel, from other countries around the world, and coming in through Central America. So how is it you can be so sure that so many are coming across the border in your view from the United States?

SARUKHAN: It's not only because of some of the tracing that we're doing with ATF, our partners in ATF, and some of the numbers we're looking at there, but also the types of weapons that are coming through our border with Guatemala, Central America, they're mainly grenades.

Most of the grenades that we're seizing are the ones that are coming from Central or South America. Most of the assault weapons are coming from the United States.

SCHIEFFER: Do you think -- or would you advocate that the United States reinstate the ban on assault weapons? Because that ran out I guess last year. It's obviously a controversial thing in this country. Will your president tell President Obama that needs to be done?

SARUKHAN: The assault weapons ban ran out in 2004, Bob, and since then we have seen a dramatic rise of assault weapons being seized in Mexico. There's a direct correlation between the expiration of the assault weapons ban and our seizures of assault weapons.

We cannot determine how Congress and the administration will move on this. What we will say is that this is one of the instruments by reinstating the ban that could have a profound impact on the number and the caliber of weapons going down to Mexico.

SCHIEFFER: What about the call by some in this country that more National Guard troops or federal troops should be placed along the border with Mexico? Do you see that as something that would be of help?

SARUKHAN: I think some of the steps that the Obama administration has already taken. Three weeks ago, Secretary Napolitano announced a significant ratcheting up of ATF and ICE agents along the border to do southbound interdiction of weapons and guns. I think that is very effective, very productive. Sometimes I think it could be more effective than placing National Guard troops, because these two agencies are charged with interdicting these weapons and bulk cash going down into Mexico. So we do see this as a very positive step in the right direction. We think that ATF and ICE should play a more prominent role along the border.

SCHIEFFER: There's been considerable publicity, of course, on this side of the border about tightening up security along the border, the talk of building a fence and all of that. Has any of that had any impact on the number of guns and drugs that are coming across the border?

SARUKHAN: Not so far. And again, what we have to understand here is that we will be able to control our border if we can control illicit traffic in moving both directions, the drugs moving north, the weapons and the cash moving south. We will have to work together. And it behooves Mexico to ensure that this common border is secure, that we're doing things on both sides of the border to jointly ensure that the border is secure, that the well-being of our citizens on both sides of the border is being protected, and that together we're shutting these guys down, both in El Paso, but also in Juarez.

SCHIEFFER: Do you think this war can actually be won, Mr. Ambassador?

SARUKHAN: I think that the Mexican government is moving in a very, very strong fashion-forward to shut these guys down. I think that if we can mitigate the damage, the levels of violence, we can continue breaking down some of the drug syndicates' organization. If we can continue to shut down their trafficking routes, their staging ground, we will be able to make great, great, great progress in the way that we fight against the drug syndicates. But again, it's going to have to be done in a holistic fashion. It's going to have to be done on both sides of the border.

And we have to be aware that if we're very successful in Mexico, this will create problems for other countries in the region when drug traffickers decide to relocate because the opportunity and cost of doing business in Mexico has risen.

SCHIEFFER: Is it still safe for Americans to go to Mexico, especially to the border towns? I know in Juarez, for example, the number of killings there is just astounding. What would you advise Americans who might want to go to Mexico?

SARUKHAN: Well, I think that if you go to Juarez, I would certainly advise precaution. I think that this is one of the places where we are pushing these guys back. We're shutting them down there. And this is a place where we have seen a high concentration of drug- related violence.

Almost 70 percent of all drug-related deaths in Mexico these past two years are concentrated in three places, Guilhacan (ph), Tijuana and Juarez. But if you go to the rest of the country, you will find a country that is at peace. All tourists that have been going down these past months can certify that this is so. So yes, if you go to a place like Juarez, I think that precaution is necessary, but violence is not prevalent in all of Mexico's territory.

SCHIEFFER: Mr. Ambassador, what if marijuana were legalized? Would that change this situation?

SARUKHAN: This is a very divisive issue. There are proponents and opponents on both sides of the border. I think that those who would suggest that some of these measures be looked at understand the dynamics of the drug trade, that you have to bring demand down, and that one way that you can do it is by moving that direction, but there are many others that believe that by doing this, you would only fan the flames.

This is a debate that needs to be taken seriously, that has to be -- that we have to engage in on both sides of the border, both in producing, in trafficking...

(AUDIO GAP)

SCHIEFFER: ... point of view on it this morning.

SARUKHAN: Thank you, Bob.

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