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April 09, 2008

Frank Luntz on "Hannity & Colmes"

Hannity & Colmes

HANNITY: But first, the rhetoric on the campaign trail is starting to have, well, a late October feel to it. Joining us now, author of "Words that Work," our own Frank Luntz.

Frank, how are you?

FRANK LUNTZ, WWW.LUNTZ.COM: It's a pleasure.

HANNITY: Good to see you, my friend. Now you're supposed to be over at Hillary Clinton's Elton John concert. What's that all about?

LUNTZ: Yes, I actually got a ticket for it, but I chose to be with you and your audience first.

HANNITY: All right. And we'll going to do this with Mark Stein, who's also going to be joining us tonight.

Barack Obama and the issue of they've now gone very conscious effort to show him as being pro-American after the Jeremiah Wright controversy. Tell us what you got.

LUNTZ: Well, the first thing is that, obviously, when he gave his speech on race, it was the first time that he used American flags behind him, and they were stacked all the way across. No matter where your camera was you got that.

HANNITY: Right.

LUNTZ: Clearly he was trying to make a statement. We've got a couple of sound bites of Obama taking what some people say a conflicting point of view on what he thinks about America.

First let's listen to Barack Obama when he's coming out patriotic, almost sounds like Ronald Reagan. Let's take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: I love this country. Not because it's perfect, but because we've always been able to move it closer to perfection.

People want a better life for their children and for their neighbors, and for Americans. It's that spirit, that sense of shared values and common destiny that makes us one nation and that has lifted America into a prosperity that the world has never known before.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HANNITY: All right. Now one of the big criticisms, as Frank Luntz said, I have had from the beginning, is bumper stickers, slogans, platitudes, words are one thing. But now the issue of Jeremiah Wright has come up. Now the comments of his wife, "for the first time in my adult life, I'm proud to be an American, America in 2008 is mean" -- we'll get into this with Mark Stein, and now this association with William Ayres, which we'll talk about later.

So do words even mean anything when you look at the record?

LUNTZ: But they do mean something, and you can see in him and you can hear in him a commitment, a change, someone who does not represent the past at a time when the American people are tired of conditions as they are.

HANNITY: But here's what -- can you teach people, couldn't you teach me to give a good speech and say, "Sean, when you say this, really mean it?" Isn't there a chance that there's Madison Avenue marketing strategies employed here?

LUNTZ: I can teach almost anybody to do that, but there are limits, Sean, to how far I can go.

HANNITY: Well, there's only so much you can go with me.

Let's go to the next one here because you got one more.

LUNTZ: Yes, where Obama has made some statements that don't seem as openly pro-America, and I'm going to defend him, but before I do, I want you to hear what he had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: We want to turn the page and write a new chapter in American history. And we should, you know, not be patsies on the world stage and in the international markets.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HANNITY: Well, there's a lot of issues here, pastor, 20 years, US KKK of America, GD America. All -- we all know the comments now. Was there in 20 years, my friend, my spiritual advisor, my mentor, on the campaign? Why shouldn't we.

LUNTZ: Barack Obama represents everything that America is about. Somebody who starts out underprivileged with a very tough road against him and manages to put it all together. Someone who makes mistakes in his life and brings it all back. Someone who takes those challenges and uses how to work with them. He is inspirational, he is an incredible.

HANNITY: (INAUDIBLE) a speech.

COLMES: He's obviously resonating with the American people, though.

LUNTZ: Because, Sean, 20,000 people are coming to his rallies.

HANNITY: Democrats at a speech.

COLMES: Democrats at a speech.

LUNTZ: How many people have shown at Hillary Clinton's rallies?

COLMES: Obviously, he's resonating in the polls.

Frank, let me ask you about a couple other things here. By the way, you said that was not pro-American to say, "I'm going to turn the page?"

LUNTZ: That's my point. I think -- that's what Ronald Reagan said in 1980 against Bill Clinton.

COLMES: I thought that was pro-American.

LUNTZ: That's what every challenger says. I don't accept, and I think it is wrong for us to suggest that Barack Obama is in any way not pro-American.

COLMES: Right. Right. John.

LUNTZ: I think he represents what is good about America.

COLMES: John McCain yesterday.

LUNTZ: John McCain.

COLMES: .once again mixes up the Sunnis and Shiites, right? This is not the first time.

LUNTZ: Right. And we're going to show viewers right now the clip -- this is something that's been affecting him over the last three or four weeks. It's clearly isn't deliberate, but you decide whether you think that John McCain has got his Sunnis and his Shiites clarified.

Let's listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Do you still view al Qaeda in Iraq as a major threat?

GEN. DAVID PETRAEUS, COMMANDING GENERAL, MULTINATL. FORCES IRAQ: It is still a major threat, though it is certainly not as major a threat as it was, say, 15 months.

MCCAIN: Certainly not an obscure sect of the Shiites.

PETRAEUS: No.

MCCAIN: .or Sunnis, or anybody else.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COLMES: He quickly corrected himself, it seems like, he was. But he seemed unsure. Shouldn't he -- and a couple of times they had Joe Lieberman in a previous speech jump in and say, wait a minute, you mean the.

LUNTZ: Now everyone who has reviewed this has said that this is just -- that this is not deliberate, this is not a fabrication, we've had issues of that on the Democratic side. Nevertheless, in terms of how voters look at politicians, John McCain has the challenge of age. I don't want to (INAUDIBLE) like in ages. But when you look at the difference between him and the Democratic candidates, you do see a difference.

He has to be more clear. He can't keep doing this or it will raise doubts in voters' minds.

COLMES: Especially since the war is not the most popular issue for John McCain to begin with. He said he's got to be where the American people are in this war if he's going to get elected.

LUNTZ: And yet John McCain has been very articulate on where he stands, and he hasn't vent himself to any polling numbers. And you can't say that about some of the other candidates.

COLMES: Hillary Clinton speaking, I believe, it was on "FOX & FRIENDS."

LUNTZ: Yes, and, again, you have this situation where, does she or doesn't she? Is she being candid and truthful or is she not? You decide.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CLINTON: I was actively involved in helping to reconcile people in Northern Ireland to the peace process. I helped to negotiate opening borders during the Kosovo conflict. I have been in many different settings where the conversations and the discussions were substantive and lengthy.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COLMES: You either get knocked for having no experience or you get knocked for -- or for having too much experience if you're John -- I mean there seems to be no happy medium.

LUNTZ: There is no happy medium, but if you weren't involved in something and if the people who were there say that you were not involved as the Irish do, I've done a fair amount in Dublin, they absolutely resent every time she says it, and yet she keeps saying it.

And Alan, I don't understand why -- perhaps you can explain to the viewers -- why Hillary Clinton continues to make claims that even the Irish say are not true.

COLMES: Well, this may shock you and some other people. I'm not a spokesman for the Clinton campaign.

LUNTZ: He told me he was.

COLMES: You know, actually, that.

HANNITY: (INAUDIBLE) has no right this week, believe it or not.

COLMES: Anymore than he's a spokesman for the Bush presidency, which he's been critical all the time.

LUNTZ: The purpose of this is to analyze from the perspective of the voters, and they expect you to look them straight right in the eye, and say what you mean and mean what you say. They expect you to be a leader in times of crisis.

COLMES: Right.

LUNTZ: And they expect you to have common sense solutions. What they will not tolerate are candidates that in any way are dishonest or make up things that didn't happen.

COLMES: Right.

LUNTZ: That's why I always say to the voters, you have to decide whether that's a sincere statement or a misrepresentation.

COLMES: Right. But is that totally made up and a whole flaw, or was she a party to certain things that went on based on being in the White House, having an office, and having the first lady's office, and being involved in some points in the administration intimately on certain key issues?

LUNTZ: But if you say that you're involved in the Irish peace process -- I don't want to criticize her because I'm going to her concert momentarily.

COLMES: And you want to enjoy Elton John.

LUNTZ: And I'd like to enjoy -- I like to -- but, Alan, if she's making claims that the Irish government doesn't stand up for, then I would suggest it would be better for her in Pennsylvania not to do it.

COLMES: All right. We thank you, Frank, for being with us. Let us know how the Elton John thing goes.

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